Iomega, Class Act or Class Action?:
A Continuing Study
Into How Iomega Treats
Its Customers and Employees

July 1997 Correspondence

June 1997 Correspondence

May 1997 Correspondence
 
March 1997 Correspondence

February 1997 Correspondence

January 1997 Correspondence

December 1996 Correspondence

Mail received 10OCT96 to 13NOV96

My responses to mail received 10OCT96 to 13NOV96 
 



 

Date: Tue, 1 Apr 1997 08:04:42 -0600 (CST)
To: jimbo@ti.com, s@TheRiver.com
Newsgroups: comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage
Subject: Re: Ditto 2GB won't read tape (see thread on Iomega rebate)
From: j.lyons@dskmail.itg.ti.com (Jim Lyons)
X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.2
References: <5h31kl$844$1@cybernews.cyberus.ca> 
<333763f8.14715630@netnews2.worldnet.att.net>
In article <333763f8.14715630@netnews2.worldnet.att.net>, 
Tingly@Sensation.com says...
>
>On Sun, 23 Mar 1997 15:49:52 GMT, e2@cyberus.ca wrote:
>
>>I've seen a few posting regarding problems with Iomega's Ditto 2GB.
>>But no solutions.  Has anyone figured the solution to this one...
>>
>>I installed a brand new Ditto 2GB and ran the install software.  No
>>problems so far.
>>
>>BUT... when I try to run a test of the drive, I get the error "The
>>cartridge is unreadable.  Perhaps it is not formatted or initialized".
>>
>>I discover that 2GB tapes are not formatable.  OK.  I go to the store
>>and buy a second tape ($25 CDN).  Still not working!  I do all the
>>trouble shooting steps found on the Web page.  Still no luck.  I
>>RETURN the drive and exchange it for another brand new one.  STILL NO
>>LUCK!
>>
>>What gives!?
>>
>>I can't believe that I got to defective drives or tapes!  I've tried
>>all the trouble shooting stuff (boot vanilla, etc...)
>>
>>Should I just return the drive and go with another vendor?  If so can
>>anyone recommend a good tape drive for about $250 CDN (about $180 US)?
>>Capacity of about 1GB is plenty.
>    
>       Thats such a catastrophic failure that the fact that it
>happened twice makes it seem like theres something wrong on your end.
>However, I sympathize with you 100%. A manufacturer and reseller
>should not only stand behind obviously defective units - but should
>also stand behind stuff which doesnt work properly given that you made
>a good faith effort to go through the obvious problems listed at their
>site.  
>       What makes IOMEGA such a deadly choice is that they deal with
>products that intrinsically seem to have a lot of problems with them
>to function properly, combine that with poor tech support which often
>drags out the period determine whether the thing works properly or not
>and you end up with HUGE problems. If you additionally end up with a
>reseller which is reluctant to take things back or help - forget it.
>You have to certifiably insane to buy an IOMEGA from a SMALL reseller
>or someplace thats NOT like Computer City , etc. which will replace
>your product at a drop of the hat. 
>        I just finished two weeks of torture with my DITTO. I found
>that SEAGATE, EXABYTE, CONNER and HP - all have TR-3 tape units - 1.6
>GIGS uncompressed , 3.2 compressed from $147 -250.  Check  out
>www.cdw.com Computer Disc Warehouse. Also check out NECX and ISN. Ive
>ordered several things from CDW before and got excellent service. They
>have an EAGLE EXABYTE TR-3 drive for $147 ,of  which Ive seen some
>posts that were favorable. Virtually all the units are competitive
>with the IOMEGA 3200 unit WITH THE REBATE!  In fact I think IOMEGA did
>downgrade their 3200 unit somewhat - some website specs state that the
>3200 comes with accel card and has a 5 yr warranty - the boxed units I
>saw at Computer City had only a 2 yr warranty and no accel card. 
>     Looking at the DITTO 2g - it just isnt that great a deal. Its
>$149 plus $50 rebate - but its a stripped down , crippled unit which
>only uses its own tape format period for writing. The EXABYTE TR-3
>uses widely available TR-3 tapes 1.6 gigs(uncompressed), free tech
>support, formats tapes, uses a wider variety of tape formats.  The
>3200 DITTO is the only unit which compares with the SEAGATE , EXABYTE,
>CONNER -  TR-3 units  and it goes for $199 internal - with the $50
>rebate. But the EXABYTE is already $147 - you dont have to wait almost
>a year to get the rebate back. 
>  

[Please see more, just below. --SL, 2 Apr 1997]

Date: Tue, 1 Apr 1997 19:52:17 -0600 (CST)
X-Sender: jlyons@dskp3.itg.ti.com
To: Steve Langford <s@theriver.com>
From: jlyons@dskmail.itg.ti.com (jim lyons)
Subject: Re: Your dot-less email address

[Hi, Jim! :))

I can understand how frustrated you have been and why you are still angry. I must say, though, that this business of not telling people in advance just what they will need to make a peripheral product work with their particular system is an industry-wide problem. By saying that I in no way mean to excuse iomega or any other company from its obligation to do as well as possible to let customers know in advance what else they will be needing to make things work.

On the other hand, it is a messy business with at least two sides to the story -- which means that without any rules having been adopted by an industry that has been growing like wildfire, consumers are most often the ones who take it on the chin. It is time for some regulations, and if the industry does not adopt such in a self-regulatory way, I guess it will be left to Congress. So, write to your representatives, because the industry is not about to regulate itself! : |

Thanks for writing! --SL, 2 Apr 1997]

- - - - -

3 April 1997 update from Jim Lyons:

... I would like to mention that Seagate's 3.2G backup comes with the accelerator card, although I do not know of any other possible problems or issues with that device. I am recommending the seagate (despite my hatred of their arcada backup s/w that we use in our shop to backup or servers) or anything else but iomega.

I guess that the real lesson for me is that I need to do my homework (check newsgroups!, etc) before making a purchase of this sort.

Comments: Authenticated sender is <jester@pop.konnections.com>
From: "Court Jester" <jester@mail.konnections.com>
To: Steve Langford <s@theriver.com>
Date: Tue, 1 Apr 1997 00:11:58 +0000
Subject: Re: Any hint of ...
Priority: normal

that you might find to be of interest. --SL, 2 Apr 1997]

Sorry it took so long, just moved and got my phone lines installed...

I found something in the classified you can put on your page.. Iomega is looking for employees.. If they are laying off so many damn people, then why are they replacing existing ones with new ones?? Anyways, an email address to add is:

[Email address and FAX number deleted. I want no part in helping iomega to recruit people, when they treat their employees so badly. --SL, 2 Apr 1997]

.. He's in charge of "Recruting Technologies".. Or something like that..

[Interesting, David! : |

I don't have a good answer to that, but perhaps do have the real answer to it:

People use employees as disposable commodities, these days, it seems. The only thing that matters any more in American business is the bottom line, I guess.

It is cheaper to use low-salaried people, let them climb so high, and then can a batch and hire some new ones, than it is to keep employees who keep demanding raises if they stay on. At least that is how I see it. Maybe I am wrong and other factors come into play.

But, something seems to stink, here.

I shared what you said with an anonymous friend who has been warming up to iomega, recently, asking what he thought, and received the reply:

"I just read your note. Yes, that is a good question. If I were running a company, and I had to downsize one of my departments, the people let go would be the first ones I would hire for other positions. I think that what happened to your friend is a shame."

I have experienced such treatment as well, David.

It probably does your particular case with iomega no good that you have been so outspoken against corporate policies. Whistle blowers are the first to go.

Perhaps you can seek help from a lawyer under the protections given whistle blowers. That might get you some back pay and punitive damages.

My guess is, though, that no sane person really wants to work for people who treat employees the way iomega still seems to be treating theirs -- as expendable commodities. How they are going to convince people that they should develop loyalties to iomega as their employer, after what they have done to some 500 to 700 people who have just been canned or are about to be canned, is beyond me.

Perhaps iomega would like to tell their side of the story. They have been mostly very quiet, however, so far as I can tell.

Thanks for keeping me informed, David! --SL 2 Apr 1997]

Date: Wed, 2 Apr 1997 19:24:13 -0500 (EST)
X-Sender: skunta@en.com (Unverified)
To: s@TheRiver.com
From: skunta@en.com (christopher d oldham)
Subject: Frustration in Cleveland is mounting!

[Personal phone and FAX numbers withheld as a courtesy.]
mailto:skunta@en.com

[Hi, christopher, Karen, and Co. :))

I think that the idea of billing iomega for your costs and time is an entirely valid approach to your problem. Of course, I am no lawyer.

I have no idea how you will collect on your bill, as there was no prior agreement that they agreed to pay such costs. It seems to me that you owe them a declaration that by a date certain they must do so and so to satisfy you or that you will be billing them at such and such a rate, give them time to act, and then sock it to them. However, you may already have done stuff like that! ;)

Perhaps you should send a copy of your invoice to the Utah Office of the Attorney General, while you are at it. If more people were to play such hardball, followed up with letters and real small-claims-court lawsuits (or even suits in higher courts), I guess that companies would not so often treat their customers as iomega has treated you and so many others.

Please write again if you get satisfaction, telling others what routes you took! :)) --SL, 3 Apr 1997]

Date: Fri, 04 Apr 1997 19:38:38 -0600
From: David Turner <dturner@mb.sympatico.ca>
Reply-To: dturner@mb.sympatico.ca
To: s@theriver.com
Subject: Iomega zippo

[Hi, Dave! :))

I really don't have any solid thoughts to throw in your direction, but I am beginning to wonder whether or not there may be some international treaty between Canada and the USA regarding fair-trade practices and enforcement. If so, it might even be that Canadians have it "one up" on US citizens in these regards! But, that is just a wild thought.

Perhaps you could look into that angle. If you discover anything helpful, please share the information!

Another question is whether or not there are any 1.800 phone numbers that work to get Canadians talking free to iomega, Roy, Utah. So far, no Canadian has told me of any 1.800 number that works from Canada. Of course, there may be some Canadian who has not yet visited this site and knows of such a number. ;) I shall always be pleased to post anything that anybody finds helpful in dealing with iomega.

Thanks for writing! I do wish that I could be more helpful. --SL, 4 Apr 1997]

To: Steve Langford <s@theriver.com>
Subject: Fwd: Iomega  <-- Take a look!
Date: Sat, 05 Apr 97 02:58:11 -0500
From: Twisted Ivory <bcox@tfs.net>

-- [ From: Twisted Ivory * EMC.Ver #2.5.02 ] --

This is exactly how I received the message.  Everything intact.
--TI


------- FORWARD, Original message follows -------

Date: Wednesday, 02-Apr-97 12:23 AM

From: Guilherme Amatte         \ Internet:    (guiba@cas.nutecnet.com.br)
To:   Twisted Ivory            \ Internet:    (bcox@tfs.net)

Subject: Iomega

Hi!

This is what I sent to Iomega.
__________________________________________________

----------------------------------------------- That's a ["The" f-word is deleted --SL, 5 Apr 1997] cause
I was the first around to get one of these. And I told everybody
to buy one and I'm still telling.

Now read the faq my friend got. Not the whole faq, just the important part of it.

2. I put a disk in the drive and the computer can't read it. The drive is clicking LOUDLY. Help!

  A technical support representative at Iomega has unofficially told me
  that there was a problem in the manufacturing process that affected a
  "fair amount" of Zip drives, but that problem has since been resolved
  and only a small percentage of these faulty drives ever made it out the
  door. No official statement was ever made by Iomega, but allegedly a
  memo was circulated within Iomega's technical and customer support
  offices instructing all reps to replace these defective drives on a
  priority basis. Your best solution would be to simply contact Iomega
  and arrange for an exchange.

[Thanks again, Brandon! --SL, 5 Apr 1997]

Date: Sun, 06 Apr 1997 00:08:11 -0500
From: Larry Mohr <lmohr@evcom.net>
Reply-To: lmohr@evcom.net
To: s@TheRiver.com
Subject: Iomega

[Hi, Larry! : ))

Actually, I prefer the random-access advantages of backing things up to hard drives (HDs) rather than to tape. I think that it is unlikely that two HDs will fail at the same time, so the files I really must back up I simply put on both of my HDs, these days. This seems to work well enough for me.

I have no great expertise, experience, or knowledge gained from other communications or reading, regarding which HD or tape products have the best technical support or the best prices, these days. However, I can say that my most-recent HD purchase was a 3.2G Fireball from Quantum. When I ran into some problems, I was actually able to speak with a Quantum tech who seemed to care and who tried to help. (The problems turned out to be unrelated to the HD itself.)

I like the 3.2 Fireball, might like to buy another just like it, find it hard to find advertised again, and find it hard to meet or to beat the price I paid for it, when comparing other HD products. My rule of thumb is now $1 per 10MB or more, before I seriously consider buying. In fact, if anybody reads this and can alert me as to where I could again find a 3.2G Fireball Quantum that sells for prices like that, I would appreciate having your feedback.

I'll bet that you cheered on the Arizona Wildcats during the NCAA Basketball Tournament! ; )

I really know no more about AT&T's ISP services than you know yourself from having read that particular letter, Larry. I do know that I get good, reasonably-priced service from Tucson-based

though. I think that they meet the highest standards in the industry, regarding quality of technical support, by the way. When you return to Tucson, I suggest that you try them. ; )

Thanks for writing! Best wishes with whatever you end up doing for backup -- a problem that just does not go away, it seems. --SL, 6 April 1997]

X-Sender: twbeers@connix.com (Unverified)
Date: Mon, 07 Apr 1997 19:05:31 -0400
To: s@TheRiver.com
From: Thomas Beers <twbeers@connix.com>
Subject: Iomega-Zip drive rebate

Zip drive purchased September 1996

Followup December 1996-

	Answer: I failed to send original copy of invoice 
			Sent Dec 1996

Followup Februrary 1997-
	Answer: They acknowledged all copies required received and advised
		all rebates to be complete by mid March 1997

Followup end of March 1997-
	Answer: Sorry but we are still working on rebates

Zip drive works great, but this is illegal and a rip.....

I am sorry that you are having these problems. Some people say that they received their rebates immediately, but you have lots of company from people who are still waiting for what was promised by iomega too many long months ago, it seems to me.

I agree that it is illegal, but who is doing anything about that?

Thanks for writing! --SL, 7 Apr 1997]

Date: Mon, 07 Apr 1997 22:27:57 -0700
From: "Gordon Sutton Jr." <remarque@bellsouth.net>
To: s@TheRiver.com
Subject: IOMEGA
X-URL: http://personal.riverusers.com/~s/action.htm

[Address and phone number withheld as a courtesy. -- SL, 7 Apr 1997]

Comments: Authenticated sender is <jester@pop.konnections.com>
From: "Court Jester" <jester@mail.konnections.com>
To: kedwards@iomega.com
Date: Tue, 8 Apr 1997 20:13:13 +0000
Subject: Anti-Iomega update!! 
CC: brooke@desnews.com, s@theriver.com
Priority: normal

[After reading that, you may (or may not) want to see more, at

Who has fax number to companies that carry IoCrap stuff?? Email them to me please.. Court Jester still has more tricks up his sleeve!!

[Later]:

Comments: Authenticated sender is <jester@pop.konnections.com>
From: "Court Jester" <jester@mail.konnections.com>
To: s@theriver.com
Date: Tue, 8 Apr 1997 21:29:07 +0000
Subject: Another email address!!
Priority: normal

Date: Tue, 08 Apr 1997 21:43:43 -0400
From: Vic <vevans@cyberbeach.net>
Reply-To: vevans@cyberbeach.net
To: s@TheRiver.com
Subject: Good News!  Polite Registered Letters Seem To Work!

Many thanks for your work in your fight against "THEY-OWE-ME-GA" a.k.a. IOMEGA. [You are very welcome, Vic! --SL, 9 Apr 1997]

It seems the IOMEGA sometimes pays attention to firm but polite REGISTERED LETTERS.

Last month (March 4/97), I sent a registered letter to IOMEGA and sent you a copy that you kindly posted. I was demanding the "free stuff" that was offered for my 2GB External Tape Drive that I purchased on October 3, 1996. The "free stuff" was a CARRYING CASE for the drive.

Well, miracles of all miracles, today (April 8, 1997), I received the carrying case! It is just over six months since I bought the drive and just over one month since I sent the REGISTERED LETTER.

I'm pleased to get the case, but it still cost me about $4.00 in postage for two letters (one registered and the earlier one not). The case isn't worth $10.00. IOMEGA ignored my earlier letter and the repeated e-mail messages that I sent to every address on their WWW site, even their web-master. Several phone calls also did not work.

I retained photocopies of all my original documentation and sent that along with my registered letter. I don't doubt that those people with less documentation and less firmness have had good results. Any reasonable company would have replied to my first letter or email messages. [It would be hard to recover the costs of the time you put in to get what was promised to you in the first place. Iomega seems to count on most customers just plain giving up. --SL, 9 Apr 1997]

I must say that so far, I love the drive and it works well. Yesterday it save me for the first time ... when Win '95 crashed. I'm now back up and running thanks to my Ditto 2 GB drive.

By the way, if you want to fight Microsoft [Hah! I'll leave that fight to you. I have enough to do at the moment, thanks! ;) --SL, 9 Apr 1997] ... I understand there are a lot of people upset with them too because of problems with '95. In one NewGroup I read a comment that '95 is quite appropriate be cause it sets up perfectly 95% of the time AND if you are in the other 5% you are in big trouble.

Best wishes and good luck to all others with IOMEGA problems. I certainly won't recommend their products even if my drive does work well. Obviously, however, I no longer have cause to be named in your class action. [If the time comes when lawyers are looking for people to be named as part of a class, you might want to reconsider your position. --SL, 9 Apr 1997]

I STILL would like IOMEGA to do the following:

1)	Put an email address on their WWW site where the messages are
actually read and dealt with.

2)	Advertise and make a public offer to satisfy all their customers who
can prove that they were eligible but did not receive the rebate or premium they
applied for. 
 
3)	Live up to their commitments and treat their customers with respect.

4)	On future models, put a power cord to the power supply.  It is very 
inconvenient having a power supply "brick" that must be attached to the
power bar? 

worked fine for me from Sudbury, Ontario, Canada. [Thanks for this, Vic! :)) --SL, 9 Apr 1997]

I also suggest that anyone having problems with IOMEGA do the following:

Write a polite letter that details their problems with IOMEGA and what they have done to try to get the company to fix them. Then send it REGISTERED MAIL to IOMEGA (with a copy of their purchase documents) and regular mail to all of the addresses you suggest. [Your suggestion that people remain polite to a company that has messed so many of them over so badly might be a tad bit hard for some people to swallow, Vic -- but I think that it is probably sound advice. No doubt, the registration (return-receipt) of the rebate submittal is also a very wise move. --SL, 9 Apr 1997]

However, I ALSO suggest that they send the letter to any major computer magazine or store that sells, recommends, or advertizes IOMEGA products. I would first tell my story and then be very careful about how the letter is worded but would ask that the magazine or store investigate the IOMEGA problems alleged on your WWW site. I would THEN ask that if the magazine or stores finds that the claims about IOMEGA are true that they notify IOMEGA of their disapproval AND that they refuse to sell, accept advertisements or recommend IOMEGA products until the situation is rectified.

As a closing people might mention that they will boycott any magazine or store that continues to advertise, sells or recommends IOMEGA products.

Next, if they have investments, I suggest that they send a polite letter to their stock broker or financial planner explaining their problems with IOMEGA and pointing them to your WWW site. They may want to ask that their financial planner or stock broker not to recommend IOMEGA stock as an investment.

They likely won't get any takers on these requests ["Nothing ventured, nothing gained!" --SL, 9 April 1997] but it may make the companies think first before they recommend IOMEGA products, purchase more of them for sale, advertise the products or suggest IOMEGA as an investment.

Steve, best wishes and good luck with your search for employment. [Vic, your good wishes are greatly appreciated and are returned! I hope you find work faster than I have! ;) --SL, 9 Apr 1997] I am recently unemployed for the first time in more than 20 years. I am one of those mid 40's former managers that industry and governments so like to lay off. [Have you been in the mining industry? --SL, 9 Apr 1997]

Sincerely,

Vic Evans
Hanmer (Near Sudbury), Ontario, Canada

PS: It may seem strange but I'm almost disappointed that IOMEGA finally came through with the "free stuff." They made me so angry by their poor service that I was really looking forward to going after them. Usually I'm not the type of person you want as an enemy.

[Me neither, Vic! ;) --SL, 9 Apr 1997]

From: srimuthu@vt.edu
Date: Tue, 08 Apr 1997 22:24:04 -0400
Reply-To: srimuthu@vt.edu
To: s@TheRiver.com
Subject: IOMEGA

Ralph Hammann, Professor, e-mail rahamman@vt.edu
[Phone number withheld as a courtesy. --SL, 9 April 1997]

[Hi, Ralph! :))

I am sorry that you have had such troubles with iomega. I hope that somebody from that company will see and respond quickly to your plea for help here. In the meanwhile, I suggest that you try calling some of the phone numbers that are available at this site (for starters, please see previous letter), and hammering away at email and FAX numbers -- all of which are in ample evidence at the

Thanks for writing! I hope that this is just the beginning of your letter-writing campaign. --SL, 9 Apr 1997]

Date: Tue, 08 Apr 1997 19:36:10 -0700
From: Stan Kurzet 
Reply-To: skurzet@ditell.com
Organization: Kurzet Ranch
To: s@TheRiver.com
Subject: iomega

When I finally got the POS [ I would not want any reader to miss the flavor, here! I puzzled a bit over this, before realizing that Stan must be referring to "Piece Of Sh*t." Sometimes I am embarrassingly slow on the uptake. ;) --SL, 9 Apr 1997] it would not work under Win95 and it took 3 weeks of frustration to get a win95 driver from the turkeys.

By the time I got it working I was so pissed off at iomega that I was unable to get any more pissed off when I discovered it was so slow that the name ZIP represents outright fraud. A SCSI drive named ZIP ought to be faster than 11MB/min. So the zip went on the shelf and it is gathering dust. I considered smashing it with a sledgehamer and sending the remains to the pres. of iomega as a token of my opinion of his POS. But I gues if some sucker comes along, maybe he will give me the price of some disks for my Syquest drive which is a lot faster.

After my dissapointment with the ZIP I bought the 130MB Syquest EZ and it clips along at 29 MB/Min on the very same SCSI port the ZIP used to be on. Plus the EZ worked like a charm right out of the box.

The long and the short of it one year later is this: The price of hard drives has dropped below 9 cents per MB. In my opinion, only an idiot would spend $500 for a JAZZ drive and 1 GB of media when for $430 one can buy a Maxtor 5.1 GB IDE drive which clips along at about 120MB/Min.

If backup is the name of the game and the inconvenience of tape is unaceptable, a cheapo IDE drive is the answer. Its faster than any other means of backup and unlike tape, you can get directly to any file.

Thanks for displaying the anatomy needed to "Tell it like it is!".

I have also concluded that other hard drives are the best backup solution these days. Unhappily, I can not currently justify spending $430 for a new HD; but when I can afford another HD, I'll put together a new Linux-based system. Everything else is just sitting here waiting for that move. ;)

Thanks for writing! --SL, 9 Apr 1997]

Date: Wed, 9 Apr 1997 08:33:19 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jason Belanger <jason@ginger.capitalnet.com>
To: s@TheRiver.com
Subject: IOMEGA Complaint

[Hi, Jason! :))

Thank you for those kind words!

I also thank you for using your own Web site to help me to maintain this site, by sharing the load of posting your own letters. I hope that your fine example will suggest to others that they can do the same!

Can you do me the favor of aiming people back to this site by placing a hotlink back to this page, at the end of the Web page where you have posted these good letters? If other people follow your great example, I hope that they will do me the same favor. You can link to

in order to bring people right to the start of your above letter.

Thanks for writing to share your good work! --SL, 9 April 1997]

Date: Wed, 09 Apr 1997 11:41:58 -0700
From: Debby <debbykilburn@ocsnet.net>
Reply-To: debbykilburn@ocsnet.net
Organization: playful puppy productions
To: s@theriver.com
Subject: IOMEGA mess

[Hi, Debby! :))

It seems as though you have Mort Arditti's letter in mind, so I have forwarded your question to him. (He wrote on Tue, 25 Mar 1997 21:48:37 EST.)

I am also publishing your question here, in case some other people can help you.

I do hope that you keep on making misteaks! ;)) They should never become too rare.

Thanks for writing! --SL, 9 Apr 1997]

[Dear Reader,

In late November 1996 I received email that I intended to "get back to." I have just rediscovered it, as I try to sort things (email) out, here.

What was being said then is as pertinent now as it was then. Perhaps if I had been more responsive to what these guys were saying, this battle would have been more successful to date. I apologize to all concerned, which may or may not include iomega. My only excuse is that I was overwhelmed.

In any case, because these comprehensive letters do not bear the marks "SECRET", "CONFIDENTIAL", or any other such indications, I am now sharing them openly here, in hopes of stirring up more action along the lines indicated than I have been aware of so far. I hope that people will respond to this "Call To Arms" for greater organization resulting in a better-directed assault upon iomega -- whose stock is on the rise as that corporation goes on its merry way.

If you would like to become more active in this fight, this is the time to get involved! --SL, 10 Apr 1997]

From: WMARKW@aol.com
Date: Tue, 19 Nov 1996 12:55:06 -0500
To: s@theriver.com
cc: DeRegil@aol.com, Marspyrs@aol.com
Subject: Iomega 

I am one of many who are having serious problems with Iomega's impenatrable electric fence to it's own customers. I differ from the ususal in that I don't take this stuff as lightly as others - I see the future when I see the present and the past.[My email handler shows that I responded to this letter, but I do not find my response. Ah! THERE it is!! I don't think that I was very helpful. Sorry. --SL, 10 Apr 1997]

I have been on your site several times collecting information for my own knowledge of Iomega. I saw your letter to the [Utah] AG and the letter AG sent to Iomega telling Iomega to either talk to you in fifteen days or that the colllecting of evidence would be the first action taken to enforce Utah's consumer laws. I just tried a minute ago to read your Iomega response sight. I get this:

File Not found
The requested URL /~jwu/wwwboard/messages/1363.html was not found on this server.

I wanted to see the response. [Ah! Perhaps memory is returning. Jimmy Wu's board went out of whack for a while and he lost a bunch of postings. Ah, yes. This is what I said to Mark: " The site is Jim Wu's, and he had some problems, since I pointed readers to that site. It did not occur to me that I need to remove that reference to Jim's site, as it no longer works.

I would go do that immediately, were I not considering the mothballing of the entire project. Few people are writing me, these days, unless I do advertising on newsgroups, etc., to stir up interest. I am plenty busy with other projects, too. "--SL, 10 Apr 1997] Could you privately forward it to me? [I said: "The response you are worried about is from a user of Jim's page, who was complaining about his own experiences with Iomega -- not Iomega's response to me or to Utah AG's Office. So, it is probably not much worth chasing in the context you bring up, here." --SL 10 Apr 1997] I want a basis on which to determine whether I will be effective in my goals with regard to Iomega if I take similar action as you did. I wish to cause Iomega an immediate massive PR nightmare - I believe this to be the most effectual manner to deal with a company that has to sell in order to exist. [I said: " That is really the best excuse for my keeping my site: To encourage such attitudes by people who agree with me. " What have you done since writing this, Mark? --SL, 10 Apr 1997]

I had posted messages in their AOL forum demanding that THEY ascertain the status of my rebate since THEY made the offer. I told Iomega that I viewed their "4 to 6 week" delivery time on rebates and free stuff as a contract. [GOOD! --SL, 10 Apr 1997] I told them that I had been waiting for 11 weeks now. (Now 12 weeks). I told them ... that by all accounts a call to the rebate center was a sidestep, a run-around and a call that doesn't get answered in less than a half hour and that if one does wait that long they are likely given no meaningful info as to status, unless of course the rebate submission has been deemed unacceptable to them and will therefore not be forthcoming. I told Iomega that this is not an Easter egg hunt and I'm not their four year old. I informed Iomega that they had 48 hours to give me status on my alleged rebate and that if they did not I would begin an immediate negative PR campaign - I hinted that it was quite easy to use their own website search engine, get correspondance info on every Iomega dealer in the world and email the text of 100 wide ranging complaints out of the Zip Technical PC folder alone. I told them I'd be back and post the [URL] of several websites where one can directly email the Attorney General of all 50 states (Some states have an equivelant - Officer of Consumer Affairs). As proof of my intention, I posted shortly thereafter with just a handful of actual contact info for said offices. Another guy posted the text of his letter to Utah AG.

This message board banks a weeks messages - mine were delted from the baord in less than 48 hours without explantion and no communication from AOL or Iomega as to why. The other guys post was also deleted - Iomega setup rebate folders at this time. [Gee, maybe they wanted you to write in a friendlier way! ;) --SL, 10 Apr 1997] You may be aware that Iomega has setup up new folder system for rebate issues and therein is a mesaage which states their intention of NOT ANSWERING any rebate questions. They reference an 800 number that rings to their subcontracted firm in Fenton, MO. [I said:" This stuff should be told to Utah AG Office" --SL, 10 Apr 1997]

I watched carefully as the other guy reposted his messages in those folders and they were again deleted in short order. Then amzingly his re-re-posts were also deleted. [Somehow, I am not amazed. --SL, 10 Apr 1997]

I have begun to see messages from stock holders in the board - asking questions like "what's going on?" I have seen a dealer post begging for rebate forms and info on how to talk with a human at Iomega. My fear is not that Iomega will stiff me for seventy bucks but that people will not beware the next time they come in contact with a company such as Iomega and that the success of these companies (in terms of dollars raked in) will be perpetuated by lack of such knowledge and the absence of informed response to the many types of issues that are tightly laced into the fabirc likely used as a curtain to hide from us or, in the case of Iomega, to hang us.[Good. Your fear remains my own.--SL, 10 Apr 1997]

For laughs, read Iomega's rebate message from "iomega TS" where TS tells us we should be satisfied to place a half hour phone call to Fenton, MO so we can ... come away with nothing substantive regarding our rebates.

Thanks,
Mark

[Dear Reader, I am somewhat relieved to see that I closed my response to Mark with:

"As I said to Dan, I am eager to have your views as to what, if anything more, I should do with my site. Would it be missed if I were to delete it from the Web? If I keep it, what should be cut, to make room for other projects I would like to post, when they are ready?

"Any and all thoughts from you will be welcome."

Now (10 April 1997) I am just going to keep posting this series of "lost email correspondence, " commenting as I go ... --SL, 10 Apr 1997]

From: WMARKW@aol.com
Date: Tue, 19 Nov 1996 18:50:04 -0500
To: DeRegil@aol.com
cc: s@theriver.com, Marspyrs@aol.com
Subject: Re: Best PR Angle

[The page at

has attempted to fulfill this need since it was activated on 1 November 1996. Contributions to be added to this page -- as well as help in reorganizing the continuously-being-reorganized Home Page of this site -- are always welcome! :)) --SL, 10 Apr 1997]

Carlos - after getting Steve's email today (saw you on his list too - theriver.com) I have to wonder if a site that people come [to] is effective. [I believe that my site is at least effective enough to keep me busier than I want to be at all this! ;)

However, I take Dave's good question to heart and am eager to have a much greater impact upon iomega by protecting consumers from what I believe to be that corporation's continuing depredations. --SL, 10 April 1997] It may be punitive but I am inclined to think that a proactive pursuit of people with the authority and or position to talk down to Iomega is a better way to do two things - to induce the discontinuation of iomega's scamming on all the tired issues we know about and to make enough .. waves that other in the electronics industry read or hear about Iomega's fatal errors. This, I think, brings us to the starting place for whatever we do.

It is a simple question -

what is our objective?

I think it should be a three piece objective with particular emphasis on one of the three. Dave, chime in with your slant on my premise that we answer this question before uniting as it were in a joint effort. Carlos - I think you'll agree that we should all be on the same page (I think we are really - just hasn't clearly stated yet)

Perhaps - just perhaps Steve at the river.com would like a hand [That would still be nice! :)) --SL, 10 Apr 1997] and that may be a side bar to what ever we do - a place to point others for a collection of information so that we don't have to write so much each and everytime we decide to email somebody.

Thinking outloud, Good thoughts which are still worthy of action. --SL, 10 Apr 1997]
Mark

From: Marspyrs@aol.com
Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 04:01:12 -0500
To: WMARKW@aol.com
cc: DeRegil@aol.com, s@theriver.com
Subject: Best PR Angle: My slant

Suggested Action Plan: 

1. Establish website.

2. Improve, enhance, collect Email.

3. Email and snail-mail legal authorites (additional ones) 
   and consumer advocates.

4. Email and snail-mail the Roy Chamber of Commerce 
   (and Salt Lake City).

5. Email and snail-mail the Mormon Church with a brief 
   epistle suggesting that they checkout this website for 
   the good of the reputation of Utah..

6. Email news organizations.

7. Stir.

8. Watch CNN.

[Moving right along, here! --SL, 10 Apr 1997]

From: DeRegil@aol.com
Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 19:27:16 -0500
To: WMARKW@aol.com, s@theriver.com
cc: Marspyrs@aol.com
Subject: Update to PR Plan

BTW the guys at Iomega won't be checking on messages during the holidays. They posted the dates they won't be responding to posted messages. Here is a chance to really load the forum up with the truth.[Did you? ;) --SL, 10 Apr 1997]
-------------------
I think that web efforts need to be reproduced in form but not in content. By changing Steve's web site's character we can make it the focal point/directory/index.[Easier said than done? ;) I am open to real help to reorganize this site into a more-powerful agent of change to iomega's policies, actions, and inactions. Both people's suggestions and direct, coordinated help are welcome. --SL, 10 Apr 1997 The propagating of Anti-Iomega web information really should be done by the users. This will keep the information current in some respects. IMHO Steve's site is monumental and can turn [ and has turned --SL, 10 Apr 1997] some people off, especially those that don't currently have problems. However, one cannot ignore 50+ sites that are carrying similar messages about a vendor. I don't think this has ever been done on the web. A successful guerrilla tactic might be the story consumer advocates are looking for. [Might be! I guess part of my reason for delay in answering your calls for my reactions to all this is that I could see nothing but too much more work for me in all this, and I have had a hard-enough time keeping up with it all. --SL, 10 Apr 1997]

To keep his site dynamic Steve must spend quite a bit of time doing all the admin. work that comes with it. I am sure that admin overhead would impede on each one of our lives. Just having to e-mail unhappy people 24 hours a day can be a drag (Steve if you will give us your opinion on this). [Sorry to take so long answering this request for my thoughts! I have simply been overwhelmed. --SL, 10 Apr 1997] I want to work on the plan and be done with it. The fact that it is a self standing site is nice because I don't want to work on a negative exercise for too long. The sites will be up 24 hours a day, carry the burden of the negativity, and if the site goes down it is not a total lost since others will be operational. Once any of us loses interest in this cause the seeds have been planted. [Despite my own silence in these regards, did you move ahead with any of this? --SL, 10 Apr 1997]

Most internet users have some allocation of space given to them by their ISP for web pages. I would think most don't use it. If your on AOL you can have up to 5 screen names. This provides quite a bit of web space. The Web is how I found Steve and as a result I was able to deliver my pain on Iomega with little additional research. I do agree with Mark "that a proactive pursuit of people with the authority and or position to talk down to Iomega is a better way to do two things - to induce the discontinuation of iomega's scamming on all the tired issues we know about and to make enough ... waves that other in the electronics industry read or hear about Iomega's fatal errors." [It would not hurt to have a cadre of lawyers who are eagerly and actively attacking every aspect of iomega's fraudulent behavior, either! --SL, 10 Apr 1997]

>>what is our objective? ...collection of information so that we don't have to write so much each and everytime we decide to email somebody.<<

If we were to create the "I Got Burned Buying Iomega " site package with basic HTML documents (both for Mac Users and PC user) and links and/or references to other such sites (consumer sites, magazine groups, Syquest, etc.). We might be able to create a very large web of unhappy consumers. We can do this without reiterating information. [How, pray tell? --SL, 10 Apr 1997] This also provides us with the saturation we need in order to get hits on various web search engines.

Granted not everyone will be able to do this. [Who is now doing any of this who is not yet listed at (please don't forget to come back to this page!)

-- SL, 10 Apr 1997] We can supply these consumers PR boilerplate templates and/or background information that they can post where they choose with or without change.

Let me know what you think.

[Well, I think that it was rude of me to let all this go so long without any response. For that, I apologize profusely. I also hope that you guys have gone ahead and actually done some of this stuff. In any case, let's all get back on the same wave and get on with all this! --SL, 10 Apr 1997]

Carlos De Regil

[I believe that this pretty well catches me up with that particular thread of conversation, except for more along the same lines from Vic Evans, today (below).

I could not possibly be more contrite about my past inactions, regarding holding up my end of the conversation regarding these particulars.

Where do we go from here? --SL, 10 Apr 1997]

Date: Tue, 08 Apr 1997 19:23:00 -0700
From: "Susan E. Jenulis" <rotts4su@gg.klever.net>
To: s@TheRiver.com
Subject: Iomega does it again

Susan (if I can't catch em, I dart em) Jenulis   rotts4su@gg.klever.net

Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 04:43:01 -0500
From: WIGG 
Reply-To: slangston@PRODIGY.NET
Organization: L & W COMMUNICATIONS
To: s@TheRiver.com
Subject: LETTER TO IOMEGA

This Is A sample of 


A letter I wrote to IOMEGA today 
 

if it can be of use to you or anyone use it. 


Scott M Langston

Corp.V.P

L & W COMMUNICATIONS

 slangston@prodigy.net

 aka:  "WIGG"

Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 11:08:28 -0400
From: Vic <vevans@cyberbeach.net>
Reply-To: vevans@cyberbeach.net
To: s@TheRiver.com
CC: love@tap.org
Subject: Suggestions Re: IOMEGA COMPLAINTS

While, I have finally received the premium, I am still not satisfied with IOMEGA's response. After all this time and a REGISTERED LETTER, I think I should have received an appolgy and an explanation, even if was only a printed form letter.

FIRST, I think it would be a good idea to move the "WHERE YOU CAN WRITE" link on your first page to just above or just below the "TELL YOUR STORY" link.

[I appreciate such "nuts and bolts" suggestions, Vic, but I am having a hard time finding either of those links.

Ah! You mean "YOU CAN WRITE", and maybe you mean "Tell me what YOU think!", I guess.

Actually, "YOU CAN WRITE" appears already at both pretty much right at the start and the end of the Home Page, already. I guess I can put "Tell me what YOU think!" by "YOU CAN WRITE".

Does that which I have just done "do it" for you? ;) -- SL, 10 Apr 1997]

I am suggesting this because when I first discovered your page, I missed it. I was so angry at the time. [Perhaps I share the blame, here. I have been trying to simplify the site and can use all the help I can get to do so. Thanks for these suggestions! :)) --SL, 10 Apr 1997] I had just written to IOMEGA so I decided to search Yahoo for "IOMEGA+PROBLEMS" and found your page at:

Your pages are excellent but they are so large that I did not read all the letters. [You didn't!?? ;)) Well, I guess that is understandable. --SL, 10 Apr 1997] After a few of them, I got the idea that I was not alone. After sending you a copy of my letter to IOMEGA I left. Had I seen the "WHERE YOU CAN WRITE" link earlier on the first page, I would have acted upon that information.

THE OTHER THING I WOULD LIKE TO SUGGEST:

I discovered some more addresses that you may want to check out and perhaps add to your list. I found a page that talks about Ralph Nader and James Loves' fight against Microsoft. Check it out at:

You or others, may want to contact them as perhaps they can help. It might be a good idea to check with them first. I am sending a copy of this message to them so they may be expecting you. Try the following addresses. [Thanks, Vic! In fact, I am almost certain that (I have written email to Nader about the iomega stuff before. At least, I know that I have copied iomega-related stuff to his email address at

On the other hand, I have sent him stuff about my

site as well, and have never heard anything at all back from him. I guess he is a pretty busy guy, but having more people writing to him about iomega could not possibly hurt our cause! :)) I'll add this info to the

page as well. ;) --SL, 10 Apr 1997]

Ralph Nader
P.O. Box 19312,
Washington, DC 20036

James Love
Consumer Project on Technology
P.O. Box 19367, Washington, DC 20036
love@tap.org; voice 202/387-8030

I also think it might be a good idea to contact _Consumers' Report_.

[Actually, Vic, others have made the same, good suggestion, from time to time. Surprisingly, I am unable to find any Web site or email address for Consumers Union or Consumers Report! Come to think of it, I recall that somebody posted a newsgroup suggestion that people write to Consumers Union to complain about that! ;)

What I CAN provide is the simple (USPS) mailing address:

Consumers Report
Consumers Union
101 Truman Avenue
Yonkers, New York
NY 10703

--SL, 10 Apr 1997]

Best wishes and lots of luck,

Vic Evans
Hanmer, Ontario, CANADA

Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 12:03:36 -0400
From: Vic <vevans@cyberbeach.net>>
Reply-To: vevans@cyberbeach.net
To: love@tap.org
CC: s@theriver.com
Subject: Please Help With IOMEGA Problems

Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 12:16:54 -0400
From: Vic <vevans@cyberbeach.net>
Reply-To: vevans@cyberbeach.net
To: s@TheRiver.com
Subject: Re: Please Help With IOMEGA Problems
References: <Pine.SUN.3.95.970410121453.14976R-100000@essential.essential.org>


Dear Steve:


I just received this very prompt response back from James Love.  I
thought you would appreciate receiving a copy. 


Bye again,


Vic


James Love wrote:
< 
< Thanks much.  I'm not sure what I can do about these specific problems.
< but we are very much interesting in the more general issue of consumer
< protection in computer problem.  I'll look this over. thanks.
< jamie
< 
< ________________________________________________________________
< James Love / love@tap.org / P.O. Box 19367, Washington, DC 20036
< Voice: 202/387-8030; Fax 202/234-5176
< Center for Study of Responsive Law
<    Consumer Project on Technology: http://www.cptech.org
<    CSRL Antitrust page: http://www.essential.org/antitrust


From: "Rene Bilodeau" <rbil@island.net>
To: <s@TheRiver.com>
Subject: Good Job!
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 21:10:49 -0700
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal

[Hi, Rene! :))

Welcome aboard!

I have added your email address to my database and a link to your site from my page of

and look forward to working with you as closely as you like {and time permits }!

Thanks for writing! --SL, 11 Apr 1997]

Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 23:17:58 -0700
From: Carl <mcdr@worldnet.att.net>
To: s@TheRiver.com
CC: mcdr@worldnet.att.net
Subject: Iomega owes me mega bucks!
X-URL: http://personal.riverusers.com/~s/mail.htm

The following language contains some

If you are squeamish about such things, I suggest that you skip it.

I have decided not to edit this letter at all, to preserve its full flavor and to share the depths of despair that it communicates. I confess, however, that I would prefer tamer language in future postings to this site.

Thank you. --SL, 11 Apr 1997]

I bought a Zip drive last September at a computer show. Price advertised as $169.95 + $50 rebate convinced me to buy something I would have considered a luxury I otherwise could not afford. I sent in the rebate certificate, UPC symbol and original receipt. About a month later I received a form letter from Iomega telling me I had not sent them the receipt. I had sent them the receipt god dammit. But I had not photocopied it. When I went back to the same computer show I'd bought the Zip at, the dealer I'd bought from had not returned and no one there seemed to know the name of the business. After calling, Emailing and mailing Iomega, I have received no responses. When I call someone just tells me they need the receipt. God dam those shitty fuckers. [Well, at least Mother was left out of it! ;) --SL, 11 Apr 1997] It's not hard to believe they mistreat their employees. Boycotting is too good for them. Where are the Tim McVeys of the world when you really need them.

[Carl!

hehe ... CALM DOWN (as my daughter likes to tell me) ... at least enough to channel all that justifiable anger!! ; )

Put a lid on the language and articulate your complaints well enough that they do not offend any person who might otherwise like to help you. Then, send the complaints -- which should contain self-contained expressions of your vehement anger -- to all of the authorities you can think of, in addition to all those I point you towards at

as well as at this site's

and elsewhere.

Use your imagination! Come up with some new people and agencies to complain to!! Tell me whom you wrote and what you said. Send me copies that other people can use as models for what they also have to say.

Please go beyond this initial venting and make good use of your compassionate convictions. You might just help to

I am no judge, and these are merely my ("CYA") opinions, but ... who knows!??

Just don't let it all die here, OK, Carl? --SL, 11 Apr 1997]

From: Ellen Wiest <ellenpot@worldnet.att.net>
To: "'s@TheRiver.com'" <s@TheRiver.com>
Subject: iomega ditto
Date: Fri, 11 Apr 1997 20:50:21 -0400

[You're welcome, Ellen! ; )

As I keep suggesting, though, posting miseries to the Web might help somewhat, but the best thing you can do is to complain to authorities who are supposed to fight consumer fraud.

Thanks for writing! --SL, 12 Apr 1997]

X-Sender: alnatoli@pop.pipeline.com
Date: Sat, 12 Apr 1997 17:59:28 -0400
To: s@TheRiver.com
From: "Albert A. Natoli" <alnatoli@pipeline.com>

[You are welcome, Al!

I wish you and all concerned with the rebate problems the best of luck and a speedy, hard-hitting settlement that exacts from iomega punitive damages commensurate with the miseries that they have rained down upon the lives of these innocent consumers.

I hope, too, that your suit will help citizens of other nations as well as it helps USA citizens. International borders should not protect scum like iomega managers from the full impact of the law, in these regards -- in my humble opinion.

Thanks for this good news, and please keep me informed! --SL, 12 Apr 1997]

To: s@theriver.com
Date: Sat, 12 Apr 1997 18:28:07 PST
Subject: Re: http://www.rebateinfo.w1.com/
References: <199704122236.PAA16027@pantano.theriver.com>
X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 2-3,7-11
From: jbc7@juno.com (jennie B Corres)

[ j,

I don't know about licensing this to NEC. I guess that would complicate things, legally speaking, for future buyers of iomega-derived products.

On the other hand, it is also possible that NEC would be smart enough to give good customer support! I do now want to prejudge that issue. But I do still seek redress for all the customers who have been hurt so badly by what I see to be iomega's own abandonment of their users.

I guess that the Damark approach to selling zips makes good sense. I never have liked the idea of coupons and rebates. But, then, I don't even go for Daylight Savings Time! ;)

Thanks for writing! --SL, 12 April 1997]

Comments: Authenticated sender is 

<ungar-lex.moish-mel-Diane-Shoshie@postoffice.worldnet.att.net>
From: "ungar-lex.moish-mel-Diane-Shoshie" 


To: s@TheRiver.com
Date: Mon, 14 Apr 1997 04:29:35 +0000
Subject: zipped drive
X-Confirm-Reading-To: "ungar-lex.moish-mel-Diane-Shoshie" 

<ungar-lex.moish-mel-Diane-Shoshie@postoffice.worldnet.att.net>
X-pmrqc: 1
Return-receipt-to: "ungar-lex.moish-mel-Diane-Shoshie" 

<ungar-lex.moish-mel-Diane-Shoshie@postoffice.worldnet.att.net>
Priority: normal

[ 1. Sue!

Well, you might see that as a poor attempt at humor, but when it has taken so long for me to learn that lawyers have actually filed class-action lawsuits against iomega for any reason -- and then lawyers ask me for advice as to what they should do -- well ... I simply could not resist!

Besides, that advice was far from being a mere joke. It is the best advice I could possibly give a lawyer.

I am taking the liberty of forwarding your email to some lawyers who may be able to help you.

I am also posting a link to it in

2. Return the zip drive to the vendor, if at all possible.

When people sell hot cakes, those should be edible and digestible. Vendors sell zip drives like hot cakes, and then most vendors and iomega seem to abandon their customers, if problems arise.

The most sensible route for customers to take, when they have any problem at all with any computer peripheral that is not supported sensibly by either the vendor or the manufacturer, is to get the product back to the vendor (ASAP!), refuse payment of credit-card charges, and shout loudly and long to all authorities, should any problems arise when you try to get your money back. That is the kind of language that the business world understands.

I hope that somebody has some ideas to help get your systems going, should you decide to ignore my advice to get your money back for all iomega products in your possession.

Thanks for writing! --SL, 14 Apr 1997]

From: "TOM HORTON" <thorton@ezl.com>
To: <s@TheRiver.com>
Subject: Zip drives
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 02:54:48 -0500
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal

[Thanks for sharing your opinion, Tom! --SL, 15 Apr 1997]

From: wpb@best.com
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 15:42:55 -0800
To: s@TheRiver.com
Subject: Iomega Mess

[Hi, Bill! :))

Thanks for the update!! Why does iomega never call people and help them? Why did she not tell you that she had just taken care of your problem, so that you really WOULD get your rebate in a few days? Why is it always the customer's responsibility to call yet another suite of iomega numbers? Because iomega does not want to honor its rebate claims, I guess; iomega seems to be doing nothing to change my mind, I am sorry to say! ;) --SL, 15 Apr 1997]

From: WMARKW@aol.com
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 22:23:04 -0400 (EDT)
To: s@theriver.com
Subject: Thanks Steve !!! 

[ Please forgive this interruption, Dear Reader:

I wrote the following email to

		Albert A. Natoli, Esq.
		Counselor at Law
		305 Broadway, Suite 200
		New York, NY 10007
		alnatoli@pipeline.com

>         Thank you for telling me of your class-action lawsuit against iomega
>  corporation, involving people's problems getting timely rebates!  I am
>  hereby broadcasting to the many people who have responded to my site at
>  
>                  http://personal.riverusers.com/~s/action.htm
>  
>  the address to your Web page on this topic:
>  
>                          http://www.rebateinfo.w1.com/
>  					(End of 12 April 1997 letter)]

Sincerely,

W. Mark Wilson


[Hi, again, Mark! :)) 


"Cyberous," eh!  ; ) 

			Bernstein, Litowitz, Berger 
			& Grossmann, LLP
			1285 Avenue of the Americas
			New York, NY 10019
			blbg@blbglaw.com

Even so, I appreciate your kind words very much, Mark! Thanks. --SL, 15 Apr 1997]

From: ccalhoun@megsinet.net
X-Envelope-To: <s@theriver.com>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 22:06:04 -0500
Organization: Use only as Directed
To: Steve Langford <s@theriver.com>
Subject: iotrash's rebate

[I guess that what gives, ccalhoun, is that iomega continues to work every trick, to what it believes to be to its own advantage. I don't understand how companies can get away with such stuff for so long, nowadays. Has it always been like this, anybody?

I make no attempt to defend the indefensible!

Thanks for sharing this most-recent twist! --SL, 15 Apr 1997]

From: FOSTER05@aol.com
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 00:19:33 -0400 (EDT)
To: s@theriver.com
Subject: Iomega boycott/rebate class action suit

[Aw, gee, J! ...

Thanks! What a nice way to start my day. --SL, 16 Apr 1997]

X-Sender: burtraw@biff.rff.org
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 09:22:38 -0500
To: Steve Langford <s@theriver.com>
From: burtraw@rff.org (Burtraw, Dallas)
Subject: Re: http://www.rebateinfo.w1.com/

[My 12 April 1997 letter to attorney Al Natoli is snipped. --SL, 16 Apr 1997]

________________________

Dallas Burtraw
Resources for the Future
1616 P Street, NW
Washington DC 20036
burtraw@rff.org
202-328-5087
202-939-3460 fax

I guess I'll never really know whether this site has really made any difference at all -- unless somebody somehow gets the inside story from iomega. But I am pleased to know that you think I have helped! :))

Thanks for sharing a happy ending!

At the same time, I encourage everybody who has been in the least bit inconvenienced by iomega's actions or inactions regarding rebates to fill out the forms that can be linked from

Thanks for writing again! :)) --SL, 16 Apr 1997]

Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 13:37:58 -0700
From: Charles Guatney <guatneyc@cwu.edu>
Subject: B*****ds
To: s@TheRiver.com
Reply-to: guatneyc@CLUSTER.CWU.EDU
Organization: Central Washington University

[Don't forget to join in the

Some small degree of success was the following message:

***

Subject: Rebates--a very big laugh -Reply Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 11:04:43 -0600 From: EXECUTIVE RESPONSE TEAM To: guatneyc@CLUSTER.CWU.EDU

Mr.Guidrey, Please call us at 801-778-1000 ext 1890. We will be glad to help you if you are having a problem obtaining a rebate. Thank You. ERT

[Big Deal! They make you call another phone number at your own expense! I hope that you and all who are going through this are keeping meticulous expense records and are also accounting for your time. --SL, 16 Apr 1997]

****

I called the number and got Bill Tripplet, Department ERT, 1821 W. Iomega Way, Roy, UT 84067.

He wants photocopies of my dealings with that bunch of Iomega B*****DS (ever notice that BUZZARDS,BUSTARDS, AND BASTARDS have the same number of letters?). [I guess that you are not completely well yet, Charles! ;) --SL, 16 Apr 1997] As soon as he gets the copies, he claims he will see that the rebates are mailed. That remains to be seen.

He also indicated he has had "hundreds" contact him for rebates. I suggested "thousands".

Charles L. Guatney, Professor
Central Washington University
Ellesnburg, WA 98926
(509) 925-5414

Sorry to hear that you have been ill! I am seriously hoping you are all better, now.

Do you think that Tripplet was pleading for your compassionate understanding for the very difficult position you have put him in, by demanding what was promised to you by iomega? Sheesh!

When will iomega ever get its act together?

Thanks for the update, Charles! Best wishes. --SL, 16 Apr 1997]

Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 22:01:51 -0700
From: Charles Guatney <guatneyc@cwu.edu>
Subject: B*****DS
To: s@TheRiver.com
Reply-to: guatneyc@CLUSTER.CWU.EDU
Organization: Central Washington University

[This letter is linked from this site's Home Page and also appears where

--SL, 17 Apr 1997]

Steve, I'm active on the veterans' boards and I have started posting the following:

***

Don't know if any of you have been burned by the Iomega Corporation's refusal to honour rebates on disks, accessories, and/or ZIP/JAZ . . . drives, but, if you have, there is an Internet site for those so shafted. Looks like there might be a class action suit. Check this site for an incredible number of responses from irate purchasers of Iomega merchandise: [Charles, as you enjoy playing with words, I am sure that you won't be offended when I share my thought that I might have picked a word different from "incredible, " here! ; ) It would not have been "unbelievable," either!! I guess I would prefer "extraordinary," which bears no semantic baggage that might be interpreted to mean that maybe Langford made all these responses up. Anyway, thanks for the advertising!! --SL, 17 Apr 1997]

http://personal.riverusers.com/~s/action.htm

IF YOU WANT TO UNLOAD ON IOMEGA PERSONALLY, THIS IS THEIR ADDRESS:

http://www.iomega.com/

I, and countless thousands of others, have rebates due from this corporation but can't get them. They have refused to answer phone calls (they now hang up) or letters (they have never answered a specific letter) and have avoided admitting any responsibility for rebates not honoured.

Times are difficult enough for veterans without having corporations siphon off a few bucks here and there to enhance their profit picture.

[Hi, again, Charles!

Might you be active in yet other organizations? (How about you, Dear Reader? ;) If so, does Charles' fine example give you any ideas?)

Here's some thought {"What, thought from Langford?", you may say! ;) }!:

     How many of you are sufficiently knowledgeable, technically, 
   that you could provide better user support for computer products than 
   the manufacturers of them are providing?  Shall we start our own 
   support company?  

     If you like that idea, respond to it and we can hold some private 
   discussions.  If you could be a principle in such an organization, 
   please include resumes and other appropriate supporting materials. 

Thanks for all your great efforts, Charles (and everybody else who is "pulling your weight")! --SL, 17 Apr 1997]

Date: Fri, 18 Apr 1997 03:09:49 -0600
To: Steve Langford <s@theriver.com>
From: "Guy D. Smith" <gy@mcn.net>
Subject: Iomega Update & etc...

Finally! I knew if I just kept bumping around in the dark long enough I'd find my way back to your e-mail. . . . [*snip* --SL, 18 Apr 1997]

I just sent-off my, "Rebate Status Request" from Counselor Natoli's website. The attached file

is a WordPerfect v3.5.2 document, 'Saved As' a MicroSoft Word v6.0, (Mac or Windows I don't know. Corel doesn't let us Mac mongrels in on much of their conniving) document, "Deflated" with ZipIt v1.3.5. You'll have to let me know how it works for you.

[It works with no problem! (Personal stuff is *snipped* here, but I had said):

-- It is easy "to trash" big companies, and to say that they "have no heart." But I find that if you give them a chance, most will bend over backwards to help people in real need. --SL, 18 Apr 1997]

I hear ya there. The marketplace will never fail. All this nonsense about one rotten apple spoiling the whole barrel is nothing but the short-term hoccum of ideologues.

[*snip* --SL, 18 Apr 1997]

___________________________

"Sumtimes ah jus' sets an' thinks...
an' sumtimes ah jus' sets

Gy..
<mailto: gy@mcn.net>

[Good show, Guy! :))

Thanks for your follow-through! --SL, 19 Apr 1997]

Sender: root@jasmine.pcpros.net
Date: Fri, 18 Apr 1997 14:41:10 -0500
From: Jim Tousignant <jtous@pcpros.net>
Organization: Acme
To: s@TheRiver.com
Subject: Bravo

Steve,

	God bless you and the wonderful
	work you're doing.

	There is a little justice in 
	the world.

	Would you please take on 
	Micro$oft next?


	Another iomega victim.

Jim

You leave me almost speechless! ;)

I fear (given how iomega just seems to plow ahead on the same old course, no matter what) that justice may indeed be left to the Lord! I am not sure that I can claim that my own efforts have yet resulted in anything like the justice I now believe should be coming in iomega's direction -- were our existing Earthly laws to be vigorously enforced!

Anyway, I do thank you for your prayer. Perhaps it will be answered. I can not say.

If you could help me figure out how to make a business out of this, perhaps I would indeed be able to take on Micro$oft and yet others, next. Do you think that I should start accepting advertisements at this site? Or would that taint the site and impede its value??

As it is, I am not always even sure that I have the energy to fight this fight, so I guess I had better keep whatever wits are left about me focused on iomega -- at least for now!   : )

Thanks for your warm note! --SL, 18 Apr 1997]

Date: Sat, 19 Apr 97 00:14:05 UT
From: "Anthony Uy" <Tony_Uy@msn.com>
To: s@TheRiver.com
Subject: IOMEGA Rebate

[Hi, Tony! :))

I am sorry to hear that you have had such troubles but glad to have provided at least a touch of solace.

However, I have not had time to go through my site and compile a thorough listing of all the contacts for iomega that are listed within the site. If that is something you would like to do, please send me a copy and I'll give you credit and make a separate page out of it.

As it is, all of the info you seek is there, but you have to do your part to find it. Spend some time getting to know the site. Diagram it, if you like. If you get a good diagram, send that to me and I'll use it with credit, too.

For these efforts to be truly successful, more people than I need to put in time doing such things and then sharing the information with others.

The

However, lest any at iomega guess that this means I am about to quit:

Don't any of you quit now, either, please! I can still use all the help I can get from you, Dear Reader!! :))

By the way, Tony, you may NOT be really stuck if you join the rebate-related, class-action lawsuit. For instance, have you any medical condition that has been aggravated by the way iomega treated you today? Have you kept track of your costs in time, phone bills, and such? Are there other costs to you that might even be seen as personal injuries, due to mental anguish, for instance?

Seriously!: Has any reader needed to see a psychiatrist more often because of the way they have been treated by iomega or any other company? Might this be a useful line of legal pleading?

What other avenues have not yet been explored at this site? Please feel free to make suggestions, Y'All!

Thanks for writing, Tony! :)) --SL, 18 Apr 1997]

Date: Fri, 18 Apr 1997 22:23:02 -0400
From: Nicholas Bretagna II <afn41391@afn.org>
To: s@TheRiver.com
Subject: iomega "click"

[Please see

for the rest of this letter, related to Nicholas's working hypothesis relating clicking to transformer problems. --SL, 19 Apr 1997]

Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 06:28:19 -0400 (EDT)
X-Sender: sbair@mailhost.epix.net (Unverified)
To: s@TheRiver.com
From: sbair@epix.net (Sally Bair)
Subject: What Else but Zip Drive?

[Hi, Sally! :))

I'm glad you found this site too! :))

Although some people "swear by" Syquest removable-disk systems (which seem to be the closest things to iomega zip drives) for backup,

Thanks for writing! --SL, 23 Apr 1997]

From: "Doug Slate" <kf4abm@usit.net>
To: <s@TheRiver.com>
Date: Wed, 23 Apr 1997 15:53:38 -0400
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal

[Thanks for sharing your story, Doug! :)) --SL, 23 Apr 1997]

From: "Joe" <joe@itsyou.com>
To: <s@TheRiver.com>
Subject: Silly
Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 13:07:36 -0700
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal

[Thank you for sharing your opinion, Joe! --SL, 24 Apr 1997]

Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 05:33:12 +1000
From: S Spinks 
Reply-To: sspinks@castles.com
Organization: Castles
To: s@TheRiver.com
Subject: Iomega

[Thanks for writing, Bob! --SL, 24 Apr 1997]

Subject: Iomega (what else)
Date: Sat, 26 Apr 97 06:50:16 -0800
From: wpb <wpb@best.com>
To: <s@theriver.com>

[Hi, again, Bill! :))

Sure is nice to have a few other feisty people around! :)) I assume that by now you have filled out the rebate form provided at

Thanks for all your hard work and for this update! --SL, 26 Apr 1997]

Comments: Authenticated sender is <jester@pop.konnections.com>
From: "jester@konnections.com" <jester@mail.konnections.com>
To: kedwards@iomega.com; CLICK HERE!,
 
s@theriver.com, wmarkw@aol.com
Date: Sat, 26 Apr 1997 08:21:08 +0000
Subject: What's up??
Priority: normal

[Dear Reader,

This letter was addressed to iomega ceo kim edwards, and is written by a former iomega employee who has lost his iomega job.

On the other hand, if you thirst for more such stuff, you can find it at

In particular, Dave's page entitled

seems most closely to present stuff that relates to the following. --SL, 26 Apr 1997]

I found something new on Steve's page at.. I forgot it.. [Gee, thanks! ;) It is

--SL, 26 Apr 1997] Anyways, you can get to it from my page under "Class Action.." [whew! ;)) --SL, 26 Apr 1997] .. There is

against IoCrap and I am going to go through my Guest Book and encourage everyone to join the lawsuit.. As for the latest gossip, I talked to one of my friends down there and now there quota is up to 4,300 a day and they can't go home until it's met!! What assholes!! Get this, I was able to collect unemployment, but now IoCrap is appealing their decision.. A month later!! Dickheads.. I have something up my sleve though.. I'll email you when it's done.. This Malaysia thing isn't working out because of wage wars.. I'm trying to gt the local newspapers to do an article on it.. And some of the news stations.. I'm beginning to think these assholes want a war.. Well, might as well have fun with it.. :/ Oh Steve, you might want to add some of this stuff to your page as well.. They are sending Tony Crespi down there for about 6months to a year!! Also they sent some Zip trainers to California to train them for a WEEK.. They have been there for 3 weeks now!! I work with a lady [Do I gather correctly that you found another job? If so,

[Well, David,

You certainly can give lessons in burning bridges, but I can't say that I really blame you. Too bad iomega can't figure out how to treat its people well and have them all pulling in the same direction, with true pride and loyalty. If they could do that, they might "do America proud"!

Thanks for sharing your salty perspectives!    ; ) --SL, 26 Apr 1997]

Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 15:59:51 +0000
From: Keith Ligon <kligon@writeme.com>
Reply-To: kligon@writeme.com
Organization: University of Texas-Houston
To: s@TheRiver.com
Subject: Switch from dollars to disks

This is complete and utter fraud. [Or, simply one person's infrequent error?? --SL, 28 Apr 1997]

I was fed up and let them have their way. I just kept the disks.
Hope this helps.

[Hi, Keith! :))

Well, all the evidence helps, but until a whole bunch of people report this particular problem, iomega can just claim a random human error, I guess. This is why I believe that it would be critical for lawyers to subpoena iomega's and perhaps Epson's own records, if a lawsuit really is pursued. I omit here my thoughts as to what iomega's response to such a subpoena might be.

Thanks for writing! --SL, 28 Apr 1997]

Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 16:53:17 -0400
From: Bob Williams <Williar2@muohio.edu>
Subject: Iomega
X-Sender: williar2@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu
To: s@TheRiver.com

[Details are moved from here to the User Club page. --SL, 28 Apr 1997]

This is a pretty sad state of affairs, and needs to be addressed. I don't know if this could be addressed by your campaign; I hope so.

If you need anything from me, just let me know. I feel cheated, and am looking for a way to make Iomega pay for their injustices (I don't mean that quite as harshly as it sounds :-). I should note, however, that I don't plan on moving away from the Zip, simply because I have too much of an investment in disks, and because it's become a sort of standard.... everyone I exchange files with has one.

Regards,
Bob

--
Robert E. Williams, Jr. | williar2@muohio.edu
Macintosh Developer | bwilliams@mveca3.mveca.ohio.gov
Enterprise Software | http://www.muohio.edu/~williar2/
__________________________________________________________
Recursion: If you got the point, stop, else see Recursion
Infinite Recursion: See Infinite Recursion

[Hi, Bob! :))

Well, this is a new one to me, but it may not be new to others. At least the problem is now public knowledge. Perhaps iomega can pay for its injustices by providing users with such problems free service for defective products. Of course, it might take a lawsuit to force them to do that.

Thanks for writing! --SL, 28 Apr 1997]

Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 17:39:52 -0400
From: "Spencer K. Whetstone" <spencer@dgandf.com>
Reply-To: spencer@dgandf.com
To: s@TheRiver.com
Subject: iomega boycott

[ ; ) ]

Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 15:38:52 -0700
From: Bernie Wieser <bernie@octavian.com>
Reply-To: bernie@octavian.com
Organization: Octavian Micro Development Inc.
To: s@TheRiver.com
Subject: what about broke...

[Hi, Bernie! :))

Good hard drives would last longer, cost less, I guess. --SL, 28 Apr 1997]

Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 18:00:26 -0400
From: Jon Floyd Schweitzer <jfs4d@virginia.edu>
Reply-To: jfs4d@virginia.edu
To: s@theriver.com
Subject: Zip Drive rebates...

[Hi, Jon Floyd! :))

I am delighted to learn that you have had no problem getting a timely rebate! Thank you for supporting our cause in spite of your own good experience with iomega to date. I hope that they will be there for you if you ever need tech support.

How much impact these efforts and those of people at other sites have had on iomega may well remain forever an unknown. Or, perhaps some investigative novelist will find the inside story and write a best seller. For now, I am just glad to have some indication that maybe all this work is helping somebody! Thanks for writing! --SL, 28 Apr 1997]

Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 15:16:23 -0800
From: Arienrhod <io@tidepool.com>
To: s@TheRiver.com
Subject: Iomega Undeserved of Your Attention
X-URL: http://personal.riverusers.com/%7Es/action.htm

Until the Zip was around, there were none, zero, dependable and affordable external media for the Mac or PC. The Zip's the greatest thing to ever happen to the computing world since the Mac. And Iomega did the coolest job of ever, and priced it low. [I used to feel that way too! ;) In fact I still admire the great engineering iomega has done. It is the lack of reasonable customer support, the problems with rebates, and the shameful way iomega has so cavalierly treated so many of its own employees that all keep me at this onerous task. --SL, 28 Apr 1997]

In response to their rebate troubles, they've PERMANENTLY lowered the price to $150. So now you don't even need to wait for the rebate. [Well,

Iomega's one of the cool companies that actually gives a damn about its customers. [I don't think so, David. --SL, 28 Apr 1997] Take your suit to someone who deserves it. [Perhaps I shall leave the next one to you. On the other hand, if you know of some companies that are even worse in these regards than iomega is, perhaps you would like to help me start and maintain the next site! ; ) --SL, 28 Apr 1997]

David Showalter
arienrhod@tidepool.com

[Thanks for writing, David! :)) --SL, 28 Apr 1997]

X-Originating-IP: [206.250.103.69]
From: "Derek Nakata" <rapier22@hotmail.com>
To: s@TheRiver.com
Subject: Iomega
Date: Mon, 28 Apr 1997 15:37:38 PDT

[Hi, Derek! :))

Thanks for your kind words.

There are many addresses for iomega people tucked away, in various corners, around this site ... which you'll find if you spend more time snooping. For now, I suggest that you go to the

I hope that this helps you to launch a vigorous campaign writing not only to iomega but to the many authorities who are supposed to keep such companies in line. Spend some time, Derek; you'll find plenty of addresses at this site, and for all kinds of people who should be interested in hearing from you.

Thanks for writing! --SL, 28 Apr 1997]

Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 03:53:53 -0500
From: "John H. Seago" <seago@csr.utexas.edu>
Organization: Center for Space Research / U.T. Austin
To: s@TheRiver.com
Subject: Trade in program for (Iomega) drives from Syquest

[John, I go to the Syquest Home Page and do not quickly find anything about an iomega-exchange program; I really don't have time to scour their site to find something about iomega. Can you be more specific as to exactly what URL people can go to, to find the info you reference, please? --SL, 29 Apr 1997]

John Seago

[Hi, John! :))

Well, I have decided that another hard drive for backup may well make better sense, John ... But I fully subscribe to the "different strokes for different folks" philosophy, too. ;)

Thanks for sharing your thoughts! --SL, 29 Apr 1997]

From: David French <dfrench@paracomsol.com>
To: "'s@TheRiver.com'" <s@TheRiver.com>
Subject: Iomega products
Date: Tue, 29 Apr 1997 08:20:18 -0400

I just found your Boycott Iomega site, and I want you to know that I'm very much in agreement with your position. I've been using Iomega products for about 1.5 years now, and if I didn't have such a large amount of money and time invested in them, I'd just scrap them and try the SyQuest flavors of products. [Please see the previous email. --SL, 29 Apr 1997]

Just in case you care (and you probably don't) [ Ow , David! If I don't care, then why do you think I am doing this? --SL, 29 Apr 1997], I first bought a Zip drive about a year and a half ago. I was generally pleased with it, except for the fact that it was as SLOW AS . After about a month of suffering under the "super-fast Zip drive!", I decided to sell it off to a colleague who was enamored of them, and purchase the newly-released Jaz drive. What a mistake that was...

Initially, I had no problems with the Jaz, except (again!) for the speed problems (Iomega claimed minimum 3.8 MB/s xfer rates, I was getting something like 0.6 MB/s. Oops, I forgot, your mileage may vary, which is a quaint way of saying "you're lucky it runs at all"). After about a month, one of the Jaz disks started acting "funny". It would click a lot, sometimes not even spinning up when inserted, a lot of funny light-flashes, generally FLAKY behavior. I attributed this to the fact that I dropped the disk once (from about 2 feet), and so was pretty much resigned to my fate. However, after another month or so, I had